skills balance

Posted by Orca on 07/20

With the changes to balance fighter types, there's still a whole lot more needing changing. The following make sense that they be based mostly on dex but to balance fighter types, well..

draw ......... seems a bit much but all these could affect
               the success rate of this skill: str/dex/perc/mind
sneak ........ perc/dex/mind rather than just dex ?
dash ......... this is very rarely used for what it was designed
               for, may as well have it available to all -shrug-
surgery ...... should be affected slightly by perc rather than dex
disarm trap .. dex/mind/perc, not just dex
fishing ...... heh, just make it random
pick lock .... perc/mind/dex
ride ......... dex/con/spirit
steal ........ dex/perc vs perc/mind, maybe lower the pre-req
               to 30/30 so con mages can loot -grin-
juggling ..... dex/perc/str rather than just dex
praise ....... -rofl- was i surprised to find dex affects this!
satire ....... and this!
sing ......... and this! -cackle-
make staff ... only dex affects the making of a con weapon?
FLEE! ........ this has to change! no matter how low your dex
               you should have 50+ % chance to flee, HOL mobs
               can't even be feared out for more exits anymore :/

From: Charity Sunday, July 13, 11:16AM

Um I'm not sure where you got these from... I realize you're making suggestions for changes, but currently fishing IS random, and dex is not the only stat needed for make staff... some of the other ones sound funny too, but I don't have the reqs memorized so I can't comment for sure.

You should also recall that a lot of the skills that you're calling 'dex based' actually have a weed-out number for dex... like, 20 or 25 or at most 30, to prevent people who are totally clumsy from picking locks or disarming traps. If you have an extremely low dex you _shouldn't_ be able to use skills like that... but that doesn't mean that the skill is only dependant on dex.

I was also sorta puzzled about why ride should require spirit... the other suggestions, some stuff might already work this way, and in any event reqs are being rewritten for skill trees. (Tho I agree if dex is actually required for praise and sing it shouldn't be... dex on the other hand could be a requirement for playing an instrument, and thus affect praise and satire unless the player has gotten praise/satire through the eloquence route instead of play.)

-Charity

From: Orca Sunday, July 13, 11:26AM

nah, fishing's dex/mind but neither affect it all that much, it's mostly that 100 mind con mages would be lucky to even reach 30 dex that brought this about but still, way too many skills are dex based and whether it makes sense or not for them to be this way it seems you're better off forgetting about realism else you may as well forget completely about the 3 fight types and instead allow for 80 dex 80 str to do just as well as someone with 100 dex 60 str (as the extra damroll would make up for less attacks for example).

oh and whether the skills listed are totally dex based or not the pre-req's on some put them out of reach of many fighter types, I'd love to see a str/mage to be just as good as any other some day.

Oh yeah, i suggested spirit as one of the stats for ride mostly because spirit needed to be included somewhere :) but also as the tame animal skill on most muds belongs to those classes with spirit as a primary stat.. kinda makes sense, druids don't just hug trees ya know, look at all them sheep in the druid compound!

From: Orca Sunday, July 13, 12:11PM

To expand a little on one point there, has it every been considered to scrap the 3 fight types leaving just arms training for use with any weapon type? It seems it'd solve a lot of problems, i mean a 100 mind mage wouldn't need to max dex or con but instead have like 40 60 80 in other stats allowing for more variation in characters plus increase the odds of ones first character to not totally suck :)

From: Belrix Sunday, July 13, 12:22PM

Okay I'm confuse about Praise n Satire....

I could have sworn you needed BOTH play and eloquence, or is that... REALLY changing now??

From: Faramir Sunday, July 13, 05:32PM

Nah dude, you only need one or the other, not both.

From: Ptah Sunday, July 13, 09:15PM

Regarding scrapping weapons proficiencies... it's one of the most popular features here. Though it does make the mud's game system a lot harder to balance, I think almost nobody would choose to lose the extra variety and interest it offers.

-Ptah

From: Shane Monday, July 14, 05:04AM

I would like to see spirit required less for surgery, and perc playing a Much BIGGER part. After all, we are talking modern medicine here, not the ancient herbalist Skills. Surgery is a skill that requires a lot of precision, and thats where i fee feel the perc comes in. Dex for surgery makes sense but only because a surgeon needs to be nimble with his scalpel.

Ok going on, Disarm trap, I agree that perc should play a much larger role as well as mind and dex.

A) you have to be able to notice the trap (perc), b) be smart enough to di disarm the trap c) and be fast enough to get the hell out of the way of whatver the trap i supposed to be. (side not I hate this board system now, i can't write a fu full line without it being cut out.) (case just proven by last sentence) Make staff and dex.

Ok yeah the staff is a con weapon, but you have to be nimble and quick eno enough to shape the tree branch into a staff, basically need to commune w with the spirits of the wood.

Sing is so damn useless, when are we going to be able to calm, entrance in inspire, etc with sing. I feel i wasted a practice geting sing just for a stupid quest.

On the whole we have to remember this mud is dex based, and until they fix it with trees 9 i figure that will be 2/29/99, or thereabouts we have to live with it.

Playing a mage with dex at sub 20, is not my idea of fun, a) i have a -1 h hitroll, and be can't flee at all.

I think one ogf my biggest beefs here is that skills need to be exactly 10 100 or exactly 50 or 80 to work You cant get 9 hits with your brhaman at 90 con or 99 for that matter (w (well rarely if ever.)

Anyhow im kind of tired and just letting a few things out.

Shane

From: Shane Monday, July 14, 05:20AM

Ok i also wanted to add, that I think as a surgeon we should be healing more then 10 hp each time we operate, it seems wasteful to me to sit there for 20 minuteds to heal someone with 500 hp.

I've suggested a few things, double the move loss and mana loss, but also double the amount of healing done to the individual

Also maybe first can be a world (mud) wide skill. not just one from the mo modern eras its so hard to heal here as it is.

I mean think about a poulticer can heal 100 hp with a minimal loss of mana and the use of a bandage and a herb or 2

Why couldn't a modern physician heal BEtter then someone using technology

From: Krynn Monday, July 14, 05:27AM

And on that happy note, I'd like to see headbutt go con based only, that way it evens out with mage stun just a little by depending on a single stats.

ie. Magestun = Mind
ie. Headbutt = Dex/Con
Mage stun = They cast it, you get stunned
Headbutt = You try, you either miss, connect, stagger, nothing

Anyhow thats just me thinking outloud

-Krynn

From: Charity Monday, July 14, 09:30AM

Headbutt IS going to be con based... make staff's failure chance is based on dex, meaning only that if you have a really low dex you're likelier to mess up at one of the stages of carving the staff, but the actual weapon quality/damage is based on your spirit... this may sound to you like a stupid reason, but the problem with making surgery more perc based is that then london hometown = perc characters since you'd need perc for sniper AND surgery.

I agree with Ptah that we shouldn't can the weapons proficiencies, but it would be nice if they worked differently somehow, so that there isn't this drive to get a 100 stat so you can get the full benefits of them, and mages who can only learn beginning would FEEL like they're getting some good out of it (as far as I know each prof gives you an identical bonus just with a higher req, but people seem to feel that unless you get expert it's not worth it).

-Charity reminds herself that :wq doesn't work here =)

From: Trinity Monday, July 14, 02:09PM

-ponder- half of what people are complaning about is things that already has changed in the new system. Like you dont need 100 in your fightstat to get max attack. Of course if you didnt play while the new system was being tested you wouldnt know...take a break and let the new system go in. Then you can start complaining again :)

(If the new system ever goes in -poke imm's- -joke- -ponder-)

From: Orca Monday, July 14, 02:26PM

I guess we're pretty much stuck with 1 maxed stat though unless fight skills are based on multiple stats, like con/dex for headbutt (to connect i mean, not dex/con how it is now), bash could be dex/str combined etc so a con mage won't be able to headbutt as well as plain old fighter just as it should be.

From: Lethargio Wednesday, July 16, 07:15PM

all I can say is...fix entrance so it actually like, works and stuff then we surgeons will stop complaining :)