Posted by Adolfus on 01/15
Not to beat a dead horse, but I have been thinking about the xp
situation, and had a few ideas I don't think have been mentioned.
First a question, how much xp is a plain jane lvl 50 mob supposed
to be worth to a lvl 50 char. Not counting special mobs that
are really hard, that havent been reevaluated.
Ive noticed that its possible to make a char and level only a few times
to say around lvl 5 or so, and with careful choosing get 2K
xp for a kill. It seems that lvl 50's xp for a plain jane mob
is in the 20-25k xp range. I think this illustrates just how
easy the lower levels are now, and just how slow the high levels
are.
In the old system lvl 6 was a big problem for some ppl, but
with the system today, its very easy to die twice in a short
period and then come back and level within an hour or two.
Legend in the old system, wasn't the type of mud where the mobs
came looking for you and you died without reason. You basically
picked your danger, with careful setting of your wimpy deaths
could be avoided. The oft heard phrase told to newbies was not
to die, but the real sting of death has been lowered quite a bit.
Add that to the fact of how relatively easy it is to get xp
at lower levels, and you can see just how far the difficulty
has been pushed toward lvl40+.
Im beginning to think that the problem isn't the xp split that
low level chars get, Ie that they dont get enough for killing
high level mobs. It looks to me that getting to lvl 35 or
so Is way too easy. Though I can understand making the
levels progressively harder, I think the key factor in the
boringness of the high levels, is the lack of risk and the
relatively low xp loss on death.
Now I understand that if you keep the amount of xp to get
lvl 50 the same, you can simply make the lower levels
easier and the high levels harder, just by shifting the xp
around a bit, and I also understand that players reactions
saying that mobs just arent giving enough xp at high levels
don't really have much foundation, (other than mobs that are
specially hard and should be reevaluated) Just saying we want
all lvl 50 mobs to be worth 200k is pointless and would break
the system. But another factor in why lvl 50's get such low
xp is the reduction in the xp loss from dying.
Personally I think shifting the xp gained to the lower levels
and leaving the amount lost from death would have been a good
enough fix. But less experienced players might disagree, and
say they don't like to be in big xp holes, at least they might
say this till they reach lvl 40.
I think one of the things raised when ppl say there just isnt
some hard mob I can try to kill to get a bunch of xp, is
in part caused by this change in how much xp you lose from
dying. One sorta way to give lvl50's more xp for each mob
killed would be to raise the xp from dying, right now
there just isnt a very good way to ramp up the difficulty
try a hard mob and get good xp. I think there would be
some players who would say, I want the xp for each mob I
killed doubled, and for this I will accept double the penalty
on dying. Im not sure the math would work out just right
on a one for one increase like that, and Im sure it would
not be something that could be coded easily, just don't think
this issue has been raised. How you can get 2k xp around
lvl 8? or 5? and 25k is normal for lvl 50, this is very
frustrating.
From: Adolfus
Friday, January 15, 10:02AM
Hate to keep bringing up medievia, but just to illustrate how
another system does their xp, for good or bad.
Each level, xp needed to level is doubled and they are on a 31
lvl system, not that that really matters.
They also use xp caps, wherein, each level has a maximum amount
of xp they can get for a kill, this is the only limiting factor
on how much xp a mob is worth. The more ppl in the group the
more the mob is worth, Example lvl 25 kills a mob solo and it
is worth 350k, two lvl 25's kill the same mob and it is worth
maybe 450k and each player splits that, this encourages grouping
but doesn't break the system or anything.
Not sure if this could help legend any, but I think its been
mentioned that there is a problem with rewarding high level
players for xp, while not making it too easy to kill a high
lvl mob and lvl off one kill for lower levels.
It seems like doing it like that with the xp cap could solve
this problem, players would group and would kill mobs just
hard enough to get their xp cap, and at the same time allowing
higher levels to get the full benefit of the hardness of the
mob.
From: Rufus
Friday, January 15, 01:02PM
We already have an xp bonus for number in a group, and it can
actually double the amount of xp a mob is worth.
As to your other question, the problem isn't in the scale, it's
in how tough the mobs post-level 35 are.
That is being looked into.
-Ruf
From: Davien
Friday, January 15, 02:00PM
Not sure how this applies, but its a small observation that has been
made to me that I happen to agree with after looking around for quite
a while now.
It seems there are less players helping other players out. Now there
may be many reasons for this, but the one mentioned to me, and the
one that I can agree with is people are too busy gained exp for
themselves, be it in groups or solo, to really worry sbout helping
out with all those little requests that people put on chat. If you
have to spend all your time levelling to make level 50, where lets face
it, there isn't really all that much to do other than help other players
it kind of detracts from what you can do.
Take a simple request for say, a dex neck item. I would far rather
visit HoL with a level 50 to get it than a level 44 or something even
if it is only from the benefit that the hit table would give me. This
is true of most people I would think. So I simply say its not worth it
for me to help out this person unless he/she is someone I am friends
with and thats not fun :(
Linked to that is the time it would take me to recover if I died.
2mil under the old system was not that harsh a penalty really. Couple
of hours tops to recover it. Now it takes twice as long. 2m / 110K is
ummmm 18ish. 750K / 22K is ummmmm 36ish. (guesses cause I'm rushed)
OK granted at level 44 it might be better, but I haven't tried it
and I actually think it would be about the same.
Summing up, either unintentionally or otherwise, the new scale has
in my opinion, reduced the number of bored level 50's out there who
would quite gladly lend a hand, and incresed the number of people in
the mid 40's who have limited time here and would rather help themselves
with that time, than benefit someone they don't know. I guess thats
a thought on the exp scale, as this thread is titled.
Davien Holyoake.
From: Mo
Friday, January 15, 04:38PM
I agree the problem lies in the difficulty of higher level mobs.
Even between levels 45 and 50 (mob levels) there is a huge difference,
as can be seen when fighting the captains in indus versus some
other lvl 50 mob. Most of this difficulty lies, in my opinion,
that they were created under the system when dex ruled all and the
other stats were merely just a bonus -- making near-all 100 stat
mobs not much tougher than a simple 100 dex mob.
If mobs came with a weapon of any sort, and taken into account
the damage they do with the weapon, it would make mobkilling
generally a lot easier -- more chance parry would kick in, and
hopefully visible effects upon casting weaken and clumsy.
But as stressed many times before, we lack concentrated areas
of level 50 mobs that can be harvested by a relatively small,
or even solo group. Lvl 50 xp runs usually involve extensive
amount of travelling, something I personally could do without --
if i had it my way, every city would have Klein guards and
shopkeeps.
Also, it would be nice if there were mobs that were actually
worth the effort -- the lion comes close, giving me roughly
the same amount of xp i'd have gotten if i were to kill
klein guards to the point where my hps/mana dwindled to the
same point.
In the meantime, however, it would be more interesting if somebody
disabled the darn linked disappearances in HoL, beef them up a bit,
and allow it to be a roaming ground for us. Surely the dead won't
mind getting a boost, tho it may mean they get killed more often.
Mo!
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