Posted by Mystbane on 10/14/96
I love this idea of not having set classes, as people can choose any combination
of abilities (ideally) and still be balanced throughout. Well, we all know
this is not the case. Mages can easily double time as warriors, due to the lack
of combat skills that are only available to those who choose to be 'true'
fighters. Kick/bash/headbutt can easily be obtained by any mage and equally as
effective as those of the non-mages Rage and warcry might possibly be the only
other combat skills that are just a tad bit harder to get for mages, and, as
rage is hardly useful when attack/fleeing and warcry non-dependable, it becomes
obvious that mages dont miss much as far as combat is concerned. To thwart
this, i think combat skills should require more base stats to use, upping its
primary stat to say, 60 or so and secondary to 40, or at least at the lvl of
rage/warcry, making it less accessible to mages.
Moreover, hometown restrictions should be less binding, such as ppl from klein
not being able to brew/flavor anything whereas Limans and Tarans are allowed to
brew in addition to their ability to either snipe or be a 2nd circle...
From: Donelan
Sunday, October 13, 11:05AM
You have it backwards, Mystbane. If you'll watch any of these fighter/mages
at work, you'll see that most of them are getting nine attacks per round,
once they reach the appropriate levels. So that means that they have maxed
out their fight stat, and they just barely get by on the stat requirements
for magic. I assure you, there are very few 100 mind mages out there that
have the dex that makes headbutt or kick useful.
So if you want to 'fix' anything, come up with ideas that would prevent
fighters from 'double-timing' as mages. To me, if you have a 100 dex/60 mind,
you're not a mage/fighter, you're a fighter/mage.
Of course, making it harder to mix skills and spells, as you suggest, would
make it harder to call this a 'classless' mud, wouldn't it?
From: Beam
Sunday, October 13, 04:06PM
donelan i think your just confusing everything, first mind dont complately
make mages, first off offensive spells arent the biggest weapon in my
opinion. What you consider a true mage is agrabah 100 mind mages, and most
people have known that they are harder to pkill with. whatever you want to
call them the 60 mind type mages with all 2nd circle cause words are the
the toughest mages, imho, as long as they are cause. And as far as getting
100 mind and 100 dex, i have seen it done too many times to remember with
mind/con and mind dex and one person did mind/str so there is nothing hard
about that. What your talking about more is perc. Thats the biggest setback
mages have
From: Donelan
Sunday, October 13, 05:32PM
No, I'm not confusing things at all. Mystbane suggested making combat
skills harder to get for mages. This is wrong because most people who can
will max the fight stat and then have magic as a secondary profession.
Boosting the stat requirements for fighting skills will make no difference
at all. Boosting stat requirements for magic would, because it seems to me
that most people would rather have 9 attacks and a kick that never fails
rather than spells.
It's just a different way of looking at it. If you are a 100 dex fighter,
then making headbutt harder to get won't matter too much to you. You'll still
be able to use it. And that's how most 'mages' on Legend operate.
And finally, I again say that if you act to make it harder to mix various
abilities, you drift farther away from a 'classless' mud.
From: Mystbane
Sunday, October 13, 06:25PM
Donelan, you do have a point, but what i was pointing out was the
ease in which ppl can get 100 dex and 60 mind, AND have enough
stats for headbutts and bash, so that these dex mages dont miss out
on anything.
Ok, so by upping the con req and str req for headbutt and bash, all a
dex/mage can do is kick. Which will reduce their effectivity by
a bit. What i am getting at is probably redundant if the skill trees
go in. As far as upping the stats for spells goes, maybe nice now
but it'll really wreak havoc in spell lvls. Imagine upping the
mind req./spr req./con req. or whatever on spells...mages learn
words starting from lvl2, and if you up that, they will not be
able to learn most of the words until lvl 10 or so where they
have enough rent space to fiddle with and the exact info on their
stats to get specific words. I know unless you choose constitution
or perception quite high, there are many words you cant really
learn at lvl2. If we were based on a spell system instead of
a word system it maybe possible to up their stats, depending
on the difficulty rating of a word.
What I am hoping for, in general, is to have a lot of fighting
skills that require 60+ in all combat stats, or stat req.s
similar to warcry or rage in order to thwart having characters
like now who are not missing out on much, as far as
combat is concerned.
From: Beam
Monday, October 14, 01:00AM
Donelan you say legend isnt classed and while there isnt a class prompt
when you make your character, there is a hometown choice which limits what
your character can do to some degree. It would be more appropriate to say
legend has some classless skill sets in my opinion. Also alot of these
classed muds dont make you choose a certain fighting stat. One can choose
different weapon types without having to learn a skill. This is also similar
to a class system, although you can switch as some of us do, but it costs
valuable practices. The problem has been that a certain classes have been
stronger than some others. notably dex cause, with hometown choice being
more personal opinion, add leveling to 50 as con then switching to dex, and
you have a wide selection of skills. So its just a case of one type of
of either fighter mages being to strong or the other "classes" being to weak
Hopefully new things can be added for the other classes to make them more
enjoyable and practical.
But you do lose a few things if your a fighter mage, at least if your from
tara. You dont have a big offensive weapon that does huge damage. No high
perc 60hp backstab, no 60hp/120hp immoliate, one does have kick, hehe wish i
had a practice free for it. But i like headbutts better. But at least in my
experience whenever i lose a duel its cuz someone got in a couple too many
big hp backstabs or a stunning immoliate.
